PollHow many females do you know personally who have been violently assaulted by males they're familiar with (i.e. not counting random crimes like mugging) at any point in their lives?
      – Lee J Haywood, 2009-12-05 at 16:54:40   (12 comments)

On 2009-12-08 at 04:47:52, BorgClown wrote...
Many raped women don't talk about it, not even to their relatives.
On 2009-12-08 at 18:18:01, Lee J Haywood wrote...
A couple have mentioned it to me over the years, which ought to be surprising because they had no real reason to do so. Research says that it's mostly unreported, and women are mostly at risk from men they already know personally. Feminists also point out occasions where 'rape culture' is essentially promoted by men all the time - making inappropriate remarks about vulnerable women, when they ought to be openly declaring that they want to defend women as a group. And on the bright side there are male groups promoting good behaviour. But see this awful attempt at advertising... http://thecurvature.com/2008/10/17/rape-culture-in-unexpected-places-new-pepsi-ad/
On 2009-12-08 at 21:33:40, BorgClown wrote...
The "ad" is fantasy, the post's author reads too much into it. Although I agree most men in our society have a degree of misogyny, which I speculate is a defense mechanism against the strong hormonal and psychological influence women have in men, just for being women. A misguided attempt at environment control. There is a Pepsi denial here: http://thecurvature.com/2008/10/20/a-response-from-pepsi/
On 2009-12-09 at 19:16:57, Lee J Haywood wrote...
@BorgClown: They're not reading too much into it! The boy clearly intends to assault the woman whilst she is unable to defend herself, and the man is complicit in this. The fact that it's 'only' a kiss and she won't remember it is completely irrelevant. The problem isn't with Pepsi but with the ad people who not only came up with the idea but also managed to get the picture produced. They clearly think that it's okay to promote assault against women and society will agree with them. My point isn't to attack this particular ad, but to illustrate that such attitudes are prevalent enough that many men won't even see what's wrong with the image.
On 2009-12-09 at 19:26:46, Melchior wrote...
When you say "promote" assault, I assume you don't mean literally? There's a big difference between "you should do this" and "lol." Like the recent trend for adverts to portray men as useless and stupid, it's supposed to be funny without condoning such behaviour - after all, who wants a shit husband? That being said, I don't find it very good.
On 2009-12-09 at 19:51:24, Lee J Haywood wrote...
@Melchior: The problem isn't just with adverts, it's with culture as a whole. Saying that the Pepsi advert is meant to be amusing ignores the fact that men may well think it's okay to take advantage of vulnerable women. I don't think you'll find many women who agree with that sentiment, and the supposed humour ought to be lost on them. Whilst we know that many men are indeed stupid, and it's arguable as to whether or not they deserve it as a stereotype, that's hardly the same as suggesting that women ought to be taken advantage of is it? And yes, if you accept that the Pepsi advert shows an act of assault about to take place then it is indeed promoting assault. That's what adverts do - they promote things.
On 2009-12-09 at 20:22:51, Melchior wrote...
@Lee J Haywood: Have you met many men who would actually assault an unconscious and possibly dying woman? I'm sure many might joke about it, but I doubt all but a small minority would actually do so. If I'm wrong it would be a very sorry time to be living in. With regard to advertising, if an advert said "buy our shoes - it makes you quiet, and easier to creep up on women with!" then that would be promoting assault. The pepsi ad seems to me like "hey look, we do blokes humor, hurrhurr. Aren't we good friends, now please buy our drink." It's insulting to the intelligence and integrity of men as well as women - but hey, that's advertising in a nutshell. I hope you're not suggesting that people would see the advert and be inspired to assault someone they found attractive. Sounds a lot like the gateway drugs argument, or the "dirty thoughts == dirty deeds" dross that some fundamentalists churn out.
On 2009-12-09 at 20:43:55, Lee J Haywood wrote...
Again, I'm not talking about that advert in particular. It's merely a symptom of a general issue. In fact men do take advantage of unconscious women, though they're not generally dying at the time - merely intoxicated. And they do take advantage of vulnerable women who may be conscious. The issue is that if no-one sees that these assaults are wrong, then some men won't stop and reconsider their actions - peer pressure can go a long way in showing them that taking advantage is inappropriate. The advert in itself may be shrugged off as relatively harmless, but its message shouldn't be. You're right that many if not most men don't need persuading of this, but it's not right when the majority of men imply that it's okay to take advantage of vulnerable women whilst not doing so themselves. They make know they're joking, but the men listening to them may not.
On 2009-12-09 at 21:17:29, BorgClown wrote...
Abuse is unfortunately very ingrained in our societies, mostly because it's our instinct. Women are not all Mother Theresas: Moms impose arbitrary limits to their children, just to feel in control, beautiful women abuse young boys because they know they'll tolerate it, and there's the stereotypically female emotional pressure on men. We people in general (men or women) do our share of abuse, sometimes so subtle you won't know until someone else questions it, although women have the emotional advantage and men the physical one. What I'm telling is that all forms of abuse are unacceptable, do not single women out.
On 2009-12-09 at 21:25:56, BorgClown wrote...
My ideal society would be one where all psychologically sound adults are equals, irrespective of their sex. The stronger help the weaker when physical force is needed, but otherwise not pamper them. It irritates me when some women demand the right to be pampered, i. e., when people make a line for something and a woman expects to be let in to the front even if she arrived late.
On 2009-12-09 at 21:26:13, Melchior wrote...
@Lee J Haywood: Ok, I get where you're coming from now. We do seem to have this assumption that drunken assaults are more acceptable than ordinary ones; I'm not sure where it comes from, general binge-drinking culture I guess. I will disagree slightly though with the typical feminist view that it's all the fault of men. If you go on a night out with the aim to get absolutely wasted and sleep with a stranger, your stranger-to-be presumably has the same goal in mind. When you accidentally get a bit too wasted, don't be too surprised at the possible results. Obviously that's no excuse, but your lack of personal responsibility is pretty shameful too.
On 2009-12-09 at 22:03:51, Lee J Haywood wrote...
There's always going to be a biological drive that makes men make bad decisions, but those instincts can be controlled (in theory) by conscious will and forethought. If you baulk at an idea when you're sober, you're less likely to make a mistake whilst drunk. It's not really a question of it being the 'fault of men', just that those men who do abuse give the rest of us a bad reputation which we don't deserve. As some feminists point out, if we set an example as peers we can make at least some difference to attitudes generally. The situation in the Pepsi advert may be only humorous to you, but it may influence someone who is young and impressionable - i.e. who hasn't yet fully worked out what is normal and what is unacceptable.